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Erwan Le Corre talks Bodyweight – Part I

July 30, 2013 By Paul "Coach" Wade 14 Comments

Erwin_pic5
      Erwan Le Corre is the founder        of MovNat.

Erwan Le Corre is an icon in modern fitness. Men’s Health once declared that he ranked amongst the fittest men in the world. Whatever your personal definition of “fitness”, Erwan undeniably has an amazing pedigree; in fact he is considered by many researchers to be the modern-day inheritor of the French Physical Education tradition.

Erwan spent his childhood exploring the countryside and training in the martial arts. He went on to become the most famous protégé of Jean Haberey, the notorious French stuntman and athlete. Haberey’s students met at night, and climbed bridges, ran and jumped across the urban skyline, and fought hand-to-hand in sewers. Haberey‘s underground society—dubbed Combat Vital—is widely considered to be an important forerunner of the modern bodyweight arts parkour and free running.

After seven years, Erwan left Combat Vital, and plunged into an intense period of in-depth research into traditional training methods. The result of these years of study and experiment was MovNat, Erwan’s physical education and fitness system which promotes authentic, natural movement through activities such as running, crawling, climbing and swimming.

Paul “Coach” Wade (author of Convict Conditioning) recently got the chance to ask Erwan his opinion on all things bodyweight, on behalf of the PCC community. The two-part interview that follows presents a unique insight into Erwan’s radical—and powerful—training philosophy. Erwan goes in-depth and pulls no punches, telling us exactly what is right with modern training—and also what’s very, very wrong.

If you are interested in bodyweight strength or movement training, you do not want to miss this!

Paul Wade: Erwan, thanks for agreeing to answer a few questions. Many people see you as the modern inheritor of a long tradition of “natural” physical culture.

Who is your all-time hero in physical culture, and why?

Erwan Le Corre: Paul thanks for inviting me, it’s appreciated.

First off I would like to dissociate Physical Culture on the one hand and Physical Education on the other. Historically there is some overlap between the two, but physical culture was mainly orientated towards feats of strength and the development of sculptural physiques. The term “culturist” comes from it, and is the forerunner of modern bodybuilding. Think Eugen Sandow or P.H. Clias for instance, the “Arnolds” of their time. I’m not saying they were not physical educators in some way, but in this regard there is, in my opinion, more substance to find when looking at the history of Physical Education.

Physical educators of the past had at heart the complete physical development of young people and the general population. So their aim was not just strength or sculptural physiques as in Physical Culture, but a more harmonious, general, and practical development of the body and mind. The type of “gymnastics” and “calisthenics” they promoted had not so much to do with a modern approach to gymnastics and calisthenics, in the sense that a lot of the training was based on practical skills. Movement skills practice such as jumping, running, climbing, throwing, carrying etc…were not done just for aesthetics, and not just for general physical conditioning through bodyweight exercise. The approach was way more practical, with exercises strongly resembling real-world physical actions and apparatus mimicking the environmental and situational demands of the real-world (there was also often a strong correlation with military needs and nationalistic ideas).

So of course my personal, all-time hero is the famous French physical education pioneer Georges Hebert. The reason is that he did emphasize utilitarian training as well as contact with nature like I do. He’s my big inspiration, though not the only one. But the history of physical education doesn’t start or end with him. There were wonderful other pioneers before him (who did strongly inspire Hebert, such as Amoros or Jahn), and there are quite competent innovators that came after him too. Sorry for the discourse in Physical Education history in Europe, I hope more people start to understand that “functional fitness” didn’t start with kettlebells or modern calisthenics. There’s a LONG line of people before us and a long history of methods, systems and programs. There’s nothing new under the sun!

Erwin_pic1
A rare physique shot of Georges Herbert (1875-1957). Herbert developed bodyweight assault courses for the military which were later dubbed ‘parcours du combattan’ —the path/course of the warrior.

Paul Wade: There’s no doubt about it—you’re right, there’s nothing new in physical training. Nothing good, anyway! Let’s look a little at how you go about “Physical Education”. A lot of MovNat seems to be based around moving the body in different ways. “Body competency” seems to be a huge part of what you and MovNat are about. Could you tell us a little about your philosophy of bodyweight training?

Erwan Le Corre: Well, prepare for a lengthy answer! MovNat is based around moving the human body in all the ways that are natural to it. To understand what “natural” entails from our perspective, you want to imagine a wild human animal, maybe one of our common ancestors, or one of the remaining ancestral hunter-gatherers, moving through natural environments for survival. Having to seize opportunities while avoiding threats. Unless they’re resting, playing or dancing, the movements they will have to perform are all PRACTICAL; they aim at doing something immediately useful in a variety of situations of the real life. Secondly they are ADAPTABLE, they must adapt to the physical environment where you are.

This simple observation has a lot to do with the way we approach physical training in MovNat. First off we focus on the practicality of the movements we train. For instance performing a “human flag” does have value from a bodyweight strength standpoint, but not so much from a practical standpoint; therefore it may be trained occasionally as part of your overall physical experience and background. Comparatively, significantly more attention and energy will be dedicated to actually practical climbing techniques, for instance a “tuck pop-up”, or climbing strength and conditioning movements, for instance the “forearm pull-up” which is the discrete component of the “tuck pop-up” that requires more power.

Erwin_pic2
There’s more than one way to pull yourself up—if you have the strength. How many methods have you explored?

Environmental adaptability is the second main pillar of our philosophy. If you train a given jumping technique, say a broad jump, you are not just considering the strength gain and other physiological adaptations by training this movement at a greater volume or intensity. You are also looking at finely tuning your motor-control skills by increasing environmental complexity. Greater environmental complexity means a physical environment that becomes progressively more challenging. This can be starting first by jumping at ground level on a flat floor, then landing on a flat but restricted surface (still at ground level), then jumping from and/or landing on a small, slightly elevated surface, and ultimately performing a similar jumping technique but at a height, landing on a narrow, uneven surface, and potentially involving a danger in case of a fall.

That’s an example of progression in (environmental) complexity, without necessarily an increase in volume or intensity. The movement pattern remains the same, the volume and intensity too, but you must finely tune your motor-control if you want to be both effective (doing it successfully) and efficient (with minimal energy expenditure, in the shortest time, in a mentally relaxed state etc…). You see there is more to greater performance than just volume and intensity. When you add to the mix the necessity to increase movement adaptability, you open a whole new world of possibilities and challenges. It can be intimidating to those who prefer not challenging their comfort zone too much, but it is going to thrill those who want optimum preparedness for the real world. No extra amount of general conditioning will ever compensate for a lack of motor-skills and adaptability.

Erwin_pic3
“No extra amount of general conditioning will ever compensate for a lack of motor-skills and adaptability.” –Erwan Le Corre

So yes, physical competency to us is movement competence and to develop it you need motor-skills, strength and other aspects of conditioning. This being said, we are not restricted to bodyweight. To us bodyweight just means locomotive skills such as running, jumping, crawling, balancing, climbing etc…i.e., moving your body through various environments. Sometimes, you need to move both your body and an external object, and your bodyweight movement becomes a manipulative action against greater resistance if for instance you’re lifting and carrying something heavy, and this is practical and adaptable training too.

I like to tell people, especially the big dudes who are mostly focused on strength and lifting heavy, that before they moving “heavy s**t”, they must be able to move the “heavy s**t” that they are. They usually get it because the heavier you get in bodyweight, the more difficult it can become to move your body with complex movements and through complex environments. They know it and can feel it inside, so it is hard to argue with something that just makes sense.

So physical competency starts with being to move your own body skillfully before anything else. My good friend Gray Cook says, “Don’t add strength to dysfunction” and he is so damn right. This simple common-sense is probably what led him to create the CK-FMS, so that kettlebell practitioners who primarily focus on the external load, manipulative side of exercise, would rediscover fundamental human movements and positions. After fixing basic dysfunctions they can better put their strength to use, or develop even more strength once they got rid of physical limitations, such as lacking full range of mobility. Move your body skillfully first, then skillfully move stuff around, not the other way around.

Paul Wade: I am in agreement with this, completely. It’s ridiculous how many people I see trying to squat with loaded barbells when they can’t even squat properly with their own bodyweight. A lot of the older generations of lifters and bodybuilders (pre-1960s) all did bodyweight work before, and alongside their weighted training to keep these essential skills at a high level.

Your attitude to “practical” movements is really interesting. These days, people are beginning to realize that calisthenics is about more than formal exercises like push-ups and sit-ups; bodyweight training can encompass a massive range of activities including “natural” exercises like crawling, balancing, jumping, and so on. I tend to think that both these types of bodyweight work—the formal/systematic, and the free/natural—work really well side-by-side in a training program.

What kind of role do more formal, traditional exercises (e.g., pull-ups, push-ups, bodyweight squats) have in your method?

Erwan Le Corre: People start rediscovering movement as whole, and there’s a slow shift of perception and paradigm towards a more movement-based approach to fitness. So far movements, usually basic, segmental and mechanistic movements have been used for the purpose of muscle building, strength or conditioning. With MovNat the approach is different, as the purpose of movement is movement itself, or movement competency if you prefer.

Muscles and joints are the tools, much less a finality. This being said, to perform practical movements effectively you do need a functional body that is also conditioned and strong. You will need full range of mobility, stability and strength, power, coordination, endurance, spatial awareness (proprioception and exteroception), and so on.

To answer your question more specifically, most formal strength and conditioning drills such as pull-ups have their place in our method all simply because they ARE natural movements too. Let me explain, what exactly is a pull-up? From a classic strength and conditioning standpoint it is an upper body strength conditioning drill. From a MovNat standpoint, it is a climbing movement. If you hang for instance to a horizontal tree branch and that you pull your body up, the end-goal is most likely that you intend to actually climb on top, right? You see, the movement itself hasn’t changed, but the intention and purpose have, as well as your perception of the drill. It is replacing movement in its original practical context. The strengthening value of the pull-up drill is the same, and we will practice it to develop upper body strength in the trunk, arms, shoulders, abs, forearms etc…so we can condition for more complex climbing techniques. Where our approach will differ is that we will try perform various practical ways to pull-up, for instance hanging from a much thicker surface or a flat surface, pulling hanging from your forearms (we call it “forearm pull-up”) etc…so we can adapt to specific environmental demands with effectiveness and efficiency. This is why for instance a “chin-up” (supinated grip) has much less value to us than a “pull-up” (pronated grip) chin to the bar or higher. Why? Because if you think climbing a horizontal surface and pull your body up chin to the bar, what do you do next? That’s right, you’re forced to bring each arm behind and over the bar so you can keep climbing. It is a waste of time and energy, it is inefficient.

Erwin_pic4
Calisthenics strength and bodyweight movement skills can work together well. PCC Lead Instructor Al Kavadlo is famous for his ability on the bar, but trees don’t pose a problem for him either!

You see, just being good at pull-ups won’t necessarily translate to effectiveness or efficiency in every climbing movement or surface. It is important and even essential, but not sufficient at all. The reason is that both motor-skill and conditioning need specific training and adaptation. Think SAID principle, i.e., Specific Adaptation to Imposed Demand. This is why we don’t believe in just training in a (usually) short selection of general conditioning drills, because the “reality of reality” is that more specific demands can be placed upon you and your body won’t respond effectively and/or efficiently unless it has been trained to perform specifically. To us, “GPP” (general physical preparedness) programs do work, but work only to an extent. Contrary to a common belief, our observation is that they do not prepare you for “anything”, and people with a GPP training background who come train with us realize this. Within seconds or minutes. Again, most people don’t just lack techniques and motor-control, and MovNat is not just that (a set of techniques), they also lack specific conditioning and MovNat also addresses specific conditioning (not specialized conditioning).

I hope it all makes sense! If people in your audience want to understand this approach from an experiential standpoint, I invite them to find a bar that is about 4 inches thick (such as these metal structures for swings in kid’s playgrounds) and perform these 2 tests:

-max reps (pronated grip) pull-ups (compare to max reps with regular pull-up bar). If the number is significantly lower than what you can normally do, you lack grip strength. Isn’t it part of strength conditioning?

-starting from a full dead-hang (no motion at all), climb on top of the bar until you can straddle on top of it. You can’t jump off the ground, you can’t pull on something else than the bar itself, you can’t push off anything with your feet (like the vertical poles on the side). How many ways can you climb on top? How many ways do you know, and how many ways can you actually perform? For each technique you’ve used, how easy and efficient was it? If you couldn’t climb on top once, maybe you lack technique and motor-control, maybe you lack specific strength and conditioning, or maybe a combination of both. Same answer if you could only succeed climbing on top using one particular movement. You should be able to use 3 different ways at least, and ideally all 6 ways we teach in MovNat.

Next week we’ll post part II of this interview, where Erwan talks about his approach to training progressions, motor skills, training longevity, and debunks longstanding training myths—plus much more. Not to be missed!

***

Erwan Le Corre is the founder of MovNat.  To find out more about his training approach, head on over to http://www.movnat.com/.

***

Paul “Coach” Wade is the author of five Convict Conditioning DVD/manual programs. Click here for more information about Paul Wade, and here for more information on Convict Conditioning DVD’s and books available for purchase from the publisher.

 

Filed Under: Motivation and Goals, Progressive Calisthenics Tagged With: bodyweight exercise, Convict Conditioning, Erwan Le Corre, movnat, natural movements, no gym necessary, outdoor training, Paul Wade, pull-ups, strength

Reaping the Rewards of Patient Practice—Steady Progress and Injury Prevention

April 23, 2013 By Adrienne Harvey 21 Comments

AdriennePlank1arm1legKB

While many people have broken free of the “more is always better” idea in their bodyweight or calisthenics training, it still seems like there’s a tendency towards endless reps when it isn’t always necessary. That’s something I love about the approach to bodyweight training in Convict Conditioning, especially in the advanced progressions. I’m in maintenance mode right now (not trying to make significant changes in body composition), and am still able to acquire a lot of skill and strength with surprisingly low reps of near maximal-effort bodyweight and kettlebell drills.

Most of the time, there’s an element of spontaneity with my workouts—adapting them to the energy of the day, and making the most of it, even if that means it’s time to take a break. Also, I’ll use the time after a few days of rest to test my progress on a given move, or to establish a baseline for something I want to continue to learn. These “workouts” are often more like play. Primal Move has been a big influence on my programming—or lack thereof. My goals any more seem to be focused on the strict execution of certain moves or lifts—to the point that being able to do them on any given day in a variety of circumstances. I want to do incredible things and make it look easy, and that will only comes with patient practice.

At around 14 or 15 years old, I was in band class and remember seeing some of my good friends first learning to play the trumpet. They were trying their best, but they were making some terrible sounds. That same year, my family and I went to New Orleans and I saw a street jazz musician playing a trumpet with such ease that the trumpet might as well have been an extension of himself. He seemed to make the trumpet express whatever he wanted, however he wanted. Meanwhile back at home, my friends clumsily continued to mash what they hoped were the right combination of keys while struggling to maintain their breathing and embrasure.

Every move my friends were making was a conscious effort in this early part of their learning and obviously, a lot more practice was in order. The practiced ease and confidence of a professional musician, acrobat, or other performer is something that I greatly admire. The accomplished street performer who consistently delivers amid constantly changing and chaotic conditions demands equal admiration.

AdrienneGetUp

The three stages of motor learning—cognitive, associative, and autonomous certainly apply to our training. In the cognitive stage every part of the movement or skill someone is learning is very conscious, right foot here, left foot there, etc. Sometimes people go through a mental checklist in this stage, every (remembered) detail is a conscious effort. In bodyweight exercise, during the cognitive stage we are also beginning to gain the necessary strength, along with figuring out where all our “parts” need to go! The first few times I tried to do a clutch flag I had to check and make sure my hands were facing the right directions on the pole, really think about which parts were on which side, what was stacked, where was the weight going, what needed to be tensed to the max. Now I can walk up to an appropriate parking pole and casually just pop up into a clutch flag because I’m well past the cognitive stage. Now that I’m learning the press flag, or “human flag,” I’m having to once again learn which hand goes where on the pole, where I’m facing… The process has started all over again—and that’s before getting to the strength components. (By the way the progressions for the clutch flag and press flag in Convict Conditioning 2 are just fantastic.) From the previous paragraph, my teenage friends were still in the cognitive stage, and the jazz musician in New Orleans was fully autonomous.

Generally speaking, when our form on a move gets sloppy, we are not learning, and our body and minds are in a self-protective mode. In most cases, this will lead to decreased performance with a greater risk of injury. Its so important especially with bodyweight exercise to remember that some of the moves can be near-maximal exercises. Without a barbell loaded up and bending in the middle, or a giant kettlebell to remind us, it can be easy to forget that we’re near our max—for muscles and the central nervous system. Keeping reps low, and staying fresh by taking necessary breaks (or supersetting non-related exercises) has been absolutely central to my own success. Just doing a few near maximal lifts or intense short sets throughout the day can be amazingly effective. It’s like making a small deposit in a savings account, which over time—and often more quickly than expected—really starts to add up. It helps to be dedicated, and it really helps to be a little stubborn!

Something I’ve been asked a number of times by people interested in bodyweight training is, “What do you do about injuries?” It sounds like a smart aleck answer, so I always try to phrase it politely, but what I really want to say in those situations is, “I just try not to have them in the first place, by stopping before it gets ugly.”

As a general rule, if I finally accomplish a goal exercise (a dead hang bar muscle-up is a good example), depending on how it felt, I might just stop right there and take a break. Regardless of where you are in terms of strength or skill, pushing a maximal move to exhaustion usually leads to some unpleasant consequences. I don’t want a potential injury or the lost training time that comes with it. An extra rep or two isn’t worth the risk. Besides, with a lifestyle which includes leading workshops, local classes, plus my own training, I simply can’t afford to take injury risks. Pretty sure your lifestyle doesn’t have room for needless injury either. I think, part of the learning curve with skillful exercise involves learning your own limits, and safely expanding those limits over time.

 ***

About Adrienne Harvey, RKCII, CK-FMS, Primal Move Nat’l Instructor: I started studying kettlebell training over three years ago and became RKC Certified in October of 2010, and became an RKC Level 2 Instructor in July 10th of 2011.   Kettlebell and bodyweight training have been absolutely crucial in my personal quest for fitness, and I love sharing these ultra-effective modalities with small groups and individuals.  Similarly, developing recipes to further support performance, body composition, and general enjoyment is another passion.  Go to http://www.giryagirl.com/ for more information about Adrienne!

Filed Under: Motivation and Goals Tagged With: Adrienne Harvey, fitness, goals, injury prevention, patience, physical appearance, skill training, strength, training strategy, women

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